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turbulence and windshields

 
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DHonkomp



Joined: 22 Apr 2010
Posts: 21
Location: Euless, TX

PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:23 pm    Post subject: turbulence and windshields Reply with quote

I've heard it said and have also read that you can't stop the turbulence in the back cockpit of a Starduster Too. From what I understand, the airflow from the upper wing jets down at the aft cockpit area, and it doesn't matter if you have a flat wrap, a bubble or a faceted windshield, your going to feel as if someone is continuously smacking you on the head with a high speed fly swatter.
Then one day I saw a red Starduster Too with the Kinner engine for sale on Barnstormers, and noticed the aft cockpit windshield was much higher than mine. So after some doing, I bought a new flat wrap, mounted it higher and further aft at the trailing edge. What a difference it made. If I keep my head centered I don't feel a thing, and before it really didn't make much difference where my head was, the turbulence was there. The pictures show a before and after. It worked for me, if your tired of your turbulence problem you may want to give it a try.

https://preview.ibb.co/gU4cJQ/100_1730.jpg
https://preview.ibb.co/fnCWdQ/100_1729.jpg
https://preview.ibb.co/kSUBdQ/100_1727.jpg
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Don Adamson



Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 242
Location: Lonoke, AR

PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:51 am    Post subject: Windshields Reply with quote

The original windshields on N1300S were similiar to your modified windshields. I had Airplane Plastics make new ones 1" longer as I could always trim them back.

I have seen a couple Too's with rear windshields larger than a Goldwing, probably solves the wind problem but looks...
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Don Adamson
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starn11gy



Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 46
Location: Kcpt. Cleburne, tx

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2017 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks good Dan, interested to hear how you formed the windscreen. I thought I was making mine taller in the back cockpit but it isn't enough.
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William Lund



Joined: 10 Jan 2017
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I put a larger rear windshield on mine as well. I do like the looks of having them both the same, but it's hard to notice the difference in height unless you are looking at a direct side view.

The reduction in rear cockpit wind with the larger rear windshield was incredible. Almost none now.

Tom Wilson has a front cockpit cover for flying solo, and if memory serves, I believe he has minimal rear cockpit wind as well. I have always wanted a front cover for flying solo, but have not gotten around to it yet. Too many passenger opportunities...

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Bill
Joined 2006
Starduster Too SA-300
N21NS
KSDM San Diego, California
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DHonkomp



Joined: 22 Apr 2010
Posts: 21
Location: Euless, TX

PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Bill, Did you get your new windshield from Steen?
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William Lund



Joined: 10 Jan 2017
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, I had Cee Bailey make it for me. (This was probably about 8 or 9 years ago.) I sent them the shorter windshield to use as a template and had them extend the height about 2 1/2 inches. This also resulted in the top edge extending back about 3 inches or so toward the cockpit, if I can describe it that way.

I have a feeling I probably could have gotten the same benefits by only going half that amount, but I am happy with it.

Very Happy
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Bill
Joined 2006
Starduster Too SA-300
N21NS
KSDM San Diego, California
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Tom Wilson



Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 150
Location: Fallbrook, California

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I doubt the wash off the top wing is the issue with rear cockpit turbulence. Ron Caraway, who gave me my transition training into my Starduster was very experienced in sport planes/antiques and he said any tandem seat, open cockpit airplane had buffeting in the rear cockpit due to turbulence cause by the front windshield. This includes wing-deficient aircraft such as PT-22's.

My Too has a very easily removed front windshield along with an aluminum cover for the front cockpit (converts in 4 minutes). When the front windshield is installed the buffeting in the rear cockpit is horrible. Eyes water, can't be understood on the radio, shirt collars beat my face, etc.

When the front hole is covered and the windshield removed the rear cockpit is still. I can talk on the radio, collars lay flat, etc. As a result, you have to darn near pay me to open the front cockpit. I HATE having the front hole open. And it makes no difference if someone occupies the front hole; person or no person, if the front is open the rear is a hurricane.

Also, my Too is 10 mph faster with the front hole covered. Climbs a tad better, too. Then again, I've got a hot rodded 540 up front, so my airspeeds (and drag) are generally greater overall. A typical Too may see--I'm guessing here--more like a 6-8 mph speed difference with the front hole covered/uncovered.

Now, I'm 6' 2" and sit up high in the rear saddle. In fact, the top of my leather helmet and the over-the-head band for the headset is pretty much level or 1/4" above the top of the rear windshield. If I scrunch down the buffeting is lessened considerably, but I can only do that for so long.

For tall guys the only meaningful solution is to build the plane with a seat as low as you can stand it in the fuselage, rudder pedals more forward of where they are, plus a reasonably tall windshield. As for me, because I fly so much solo, I wouldn't mind building/rebuilding a Too as a single seater (at my size a single-seat 'duster or the 10% smaller Acrodusters are "no way" airplanes). I'd turn the front cockpit into a much-needed storage locker and install a more raked, but still large windshield.

For sure a taller rear windshield will help. I'd guess a lower front windshield doesn't hurt, either. But if you can eliminate the front windshield you'll discover a new airplane. tw
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